The piano coda at the end of Tate1 Suffer Little Children

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krudster ®

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Post 12-May-2011 09:01

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Bit late to the party on this one...
I keep reading (here and on PJLM) that the piano coda at the end of the Tate 1 version of Suffer Little Children was later recycled in 'Asleep', but listening to them side by side, it's not.
I kept humming it to myself, and then it came to me when I was brushing my teeth, of all things. It's Meat Is Murder's intro piano section!
Krudster
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SweetFA

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Post 12-May-2011 12:06 (after 3 hours)

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Maybe. I suspect all three are different but a variation on a similar theme.
Can't remember the last time i actually LISTENED to the title track on Meat Is Murder, really not keen on that song, particularly that version.
Sure i read a quote from Marr saying he can only play the piano one way, may have been said slightly tongue in cheek though!
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pjlm

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Post 12-May-2011 14:17 (after 2 hours 11 minutes)

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I'm sorry Krudster, I can't hear it myself. I played them one after the other repeatedly and can't see the similarity.
Stephane
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lamplighter

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Post 12-May-2011 19:05 (after 4 hours)

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Hey you're right. Listen to MiM from 4.09 seconds, and it's exactly the same as the Suffer Little Children coda, but double the speed.
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krudster ®

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Post 26-May-2011 09:09 (after 13 days)

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Glad I'm not going mad! It *is* the same isn't it?
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krudster ®

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Post 26-May-2011 09:10 (after 1 minute)

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Also listen to MiM from 1.20. Absolutely 100 per cent convinced.
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egosheep

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Post 21-Jun-2011 07:43 (after 25 days)

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Krudster, I have noticed this for years but have never posted about it. You are absolutely right, it's the piano part from MIM, not Asleep. It's very interesting because I think Simon Goddard and others have written about it being from Asleep, but it is clearly from MIM. Same notes, same riff, 100%. This piano part is not in Asleep at all.
Stephane, listen again. I have made this file with the original speed clip, a sped-up version, a clip from the MIM intro, and the sped up version one last time. I didn't have time/talent enough to know how much to speed it up to get to the MIM pitch and tempo, but it's closer. I would hazard a guess that the piano part on MIM may in fact have been played slower and sped up by Stephen Street.
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2708212/SLC%20coda%20with%20MIM.mp3
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pjlm

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Post 21-Jun-2011 13:02 (after 5 hours)

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I guess I'm no musician as I still can't hear it. To my ears those are two different melodies...
I'll still mention it on PJLM.
Stephane
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egosheep

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Post 21-Jun-2011 20:58 (after 7 hours)

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Fair enough. I admit that some of the other people I have told about this couldn't see it either, but in person I can usually show what I'm hearing.
Also, the melody in question is just the piano, which on MIM is supporting a totally different guitar/bass melody. You have to kind of ignore the guitar and bass.
I wish I could actually play piano, as it would be a lot easier to demonstrate. Maybe some other member here does, and could do a youtube video?
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DavidA

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Post 21-Jun-2011 21:09 (after 11 minutes)

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Yeah. I would agree that it's the same. Good spot. It's hard to ignore the guitar and bass but you can hear it running through. My piano is too rusty to play this but I think you could probably play the coda over MIM and see if it's hitting the same note. Wouldn't that work?
I'm busy right now but it wouldn't take long to merge the two in Soundforge or similar.
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DavidA

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Post 21-Jun-2011 21:09 (after 27 seconds)

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In other news, I just love that coda. Have I said that already?
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SweetFA

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Post 23-Jun-2011 05:56 (after 1 day 8 hours)

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Tweeted @Johnny_Marr , his response was "nah".


Last edited by SweetFA on 2011-06-23 06:34; edited 1 time in total
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SweetFA

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Post 23-Jun-2011 06:31 (after 34 minutes)

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Question was
"Could you can settle a debate? The piano melody on Meat Is Murder, is it same as TroyTate Suffer Little Children but sped up?"
It was late and i had to keep rewriting it to get it below the limit on characters so that's my excuse for the "could you can" bit ;-)
I agree bits of phrasing sound very similar if not the same but i suspect it's coincidence rather than a conscious "now then, that bit of piano i recorded with Tate, i'll use that on this at a different tempo".
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egosheep

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Post 23-Jun-2011 09:38 (after 3 hours)

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That's extremely interesting. This is something I have always wanted to ask Johnny about. Never thought I would be saying this, but I have to say that Johnny is wrong in this case. From the way you phrased the question, perhaps he thought you meant the piano part(if there ever was on) on a Tate version of SLC. The piano coda as it is tacked on in these demos is not actually a part of the song, and he may not associate it with SLC at all. A better question may have been, when was the piano part of MIM composed?
The part is the same, note for note. I just need to find a piano playing smiths fan, and do a video to bear that out.
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SweetFA

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Post 23-Jun-2011 09:47 (after 9 minutes)

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Like i say problem with Twitter is you soon run out of characters.
I sent him a follow up, if he gets back to me i'll put the response on here.
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